[情報] Nate Silver解釋Trout是MVP的原因

作者: abc12812   2012-11-15 09:23:06
http://tinyurl.com/aza3n67
The argument on Trout’s behalf isn’t all that complicated: he provided the
greater overall contribution to his team. Trout was a much better defensive
player than Cabrera, and a much better base runner. And if Cabrera was the
superior hitter, it wasn’t by nearly as much as the triple crown statistics
might suggest.
很簡單 Trout的跑壘和防守大勝 就算Cabrera打擊比較好 也頂多只好一些而已
Over all, Trout contributed about 12 additional runs on the basepaths when
compared with an average runner. The bulky Cabrera, by contrast, cost the
Tigers about three runs on the bases.
Trout跑壘多拿12分 Cabrera跑壘少拿3分
One of these systems, Ultimate Zone Rating, estimates that Trout saved the
Angels 11 runs with his defense in the outfield. Cabrera, a clumsy defender
at third base who is more naturally suited to play first base, cost the
Tigers 10 runs with his.
Trout防守多守11分 Cabrera防守多失10分
Between his defense and his base running, therefore, Trout was about 35 runs
more valuable to the Angels than Cabrera was to the Tigers. By contrast, the
14 additional home runs that Cabrera hit (44 against Trout’s 30) were worth
about 22 extra runs for the Tigers, based on measures that convert players’
contributions to a common scale.
Trout在防守和跑壘上領先35分 Cabrera多的14轟大約只值22分
Angel Stadium is shallower in straight center field, making up for much of
the difference, but since most of Cabrera’s home runs came to the power
alleys, playing in Anaheim would likely have hurt his statistics on balance.
Trout, who hits to all fields, is less sensitive to his ballpark, and had
slightly better overall numbers than Cabrera in road games.
天使球場比老虎球場難打擊很多 客場打擊數據Trout比Cabrera略好
But much of the difference simply reflects the fact that Cabrera hits third
in the batting order, and had more opportunities to hit with runners on base.
His 89 R.B.I.’s with runners in scoring position came in 205 plate
appearances, a rate of 0.43 R.B.I.’s per opportunity. Trout’s 53 R.B.I.’s
came in just 135 opportunities, since he is the Angels’ leadoff hitter. That
yields a similar rate of production: 0.39 R.B.I.’s per plate appearance with
runners in scoring position.
兩個人的打點有差 但修正RISP的機會後 兩人的打點率大約都是0.39RBI/RISP
In fact, there are now systems, like Win Probability Added, that measure all
aspects of clutch performance in a comprehensive way. They account not just
for the number of runners on base and the number of outs, but also the game
score and the inning. A grand slam when a team trails by three runs with two
outs in the bottom of the ninth turns a near-certain loss into a win, giving
a player maximal credit by this system. A grand slam when a team already
leads 7-0 gets little credit, since the game is already in hand.
According to this measure, Trout was actually slightly more valuable than
Cabrera as an offensive player, considering the timing of his contributions.
Add in his defense and base running, and it isn’t all that close a call.
用WAP來看關鍵表現 其實Trout關鍵火力比Cabrera稍好 再加進防守和跑壘的話
勝負已經很明顯了
It may seem hard to argue against a player who won the triple crown. But
Cabrera’s numbers, while worthy of an M.V.P. award in many seasons, weren’t
historically great. His batting average, R.B.I. and home run totals would
also have qualified for the American League’s triple crown in 2008. Before
that, however, you would have to go back to 1972 to find a year in which his
numbers were good enough to lead the league in all three categories.
雖說Cabrera是三冠王 但數據上並不是歷史級的好
同樣的數據在過去40年只會在2008和1972兩年同樣是三冠王
There is also the fact that Cabrera’s Tigers made the playoffs, while Trout’
s Angels did not. But the Angels won more games (89) than the Tigers (88),
missing the playoffs because they played in a harder division. Trout,
moreover, began the year in the minors; the Angels went 81-58 in games in
which he participated, equivalent to their winning 94 games over a full
season.
老虎進季後賽 但天使勝場數比較多
Trout打滿整季的話天使勝場會是94勝
Still, the real progress in the statistical analysis of baseball is in the
ability to evaluate the contributions that a player makes on the field in a
more reliable and comprehensive way.
數據衡量球場表現的精確度變高很多
Perhaps 10 or 20 years ago, when evaluations of base running, defense and
clutch hitting were murkier, stat geeks would have argued that Cabrera
deserved the M.V.P. on the basis of the hard evidence.
若是在十幾二十年前 計算跑壘防守還不精確的時代
數據派或許會依據手上的事實支持Cabrera
Now that some of the “intangibles” have become measurable, we know that
Trout did more of the little things to help his team win.
但現在 一些所謂的"靈性"已經可以被計算 我們知道Trout做了更多的基本功來幫助
球隊贏球
It’s the traditionalists who are using statistics in a way that misses the
forest for the trees.
傳統派才是用數據卻見樹不見林的一派
作者: WadeMiley ( )   2011-01-15 09:27:00
前段是米糕不轉三壘可以贏的意思嗎
作者: tmlc (置身於Asgard)   2011-01-15 10:01:00
印象派鄉民進攻啊!
作者: hllmayday (人生海海)   2011-01-15 10:03:00
不轉3B 留1B 防守貢獻可能也不會多多少吧
作者: sean0000 (最愛喝化工紅茶)   2011-01-15 10:05:00
見樹
作者: WadeMiley ( )   2011-01-15 10:06:00
米糕1B能+3就平手 不過這種分數沒什麼好比 純屬前段玩笑
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 10:14:00
"同樣的數據在過去40年只會在2008和1972兩年同樣是三冠王"
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 10:16:00
這句話有問題,因為三冠王難就難在同時都很好啊!單項超高
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 10:17:00
每年都會看到一些,就是三樣都高才稀有啊!米糕今年各單項
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 10:20:00
原本就不是超越數十年拔尖數字的成績,那段話有什麼意義?
作者: pig (歡迎加入豬頭黨)   2011-01-15 10:20:00
如果 Trout 這季可以打324場,不知道LAA會幾勝?
作者: o0991758566 (洨馬力)   2011-01-15 10:33:00
Tourt已經確定拿到MVP了?哪一篇阿?
作者: NIETZCHE   2011-01-15 10:39:00
有沒有一堆人中文理解能力很爛的八掛
作者: msn12345679 (吼~~)   2011-01-15 10:59:00
推鱒魚哥 不過MVP應該還是米糕 現在還是印象派當道
作者: msn12345679 (吼~~)   2011-01-15 11:00:00
鱒魚哥目前形象也比較好
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 11:13:00
普神06年的可怕成績在過去40年能有六年制霸三冠王,但過去
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 11:16:00
十年動輒會遇到打率3成5以上或者猴兒50轟以上這恐怖的高點
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 11:18:00
以致於普神在國聯時期很接近三冠但就是拿不到
作者: PTTerme (童顏巨根)   2011-01-15 11:21:00
不管如何單項稱霸就是強,多項出眾是超強,兩人誰拿都合理
作者: JubeChocobo (啾比)   2011-01-15 11:39:00
如果三冠王WS沒烙賽的話應該蠻穩的
作者: rhapsody70 (soft)   2011-01-15 11:39:00
因為禁藥?
作者: CORYCHAN (CORY)   2011-01-15 11:43:00
Trout"如果"有打滿整季 問題就是沒打滿阿..
作者: alex710707 (PonWei)   2011-01-15 11:46:00
MVP又不看季後賽成績
作者: SlimeEditor (菜瓜布)   2011-01-15 12:03:00
看季後賽...鱒魚連季後賽烙賽的機會都沒有....
作者: Sparksfly (火光飛舞)   2011-01-15 12:04:00
事實就是沒打滿 "如果"不能當飯吃XD
作者: enthusiasm (小白)   2011-01-15 12:32:00
Lahair季初鬼神狀態 打下去就....
作者: a12582002 (瘋~柏)   2011-01-15 12:49:00
就沒看季後賽成績了還在講....
作者: jagdzaku (聯邦去死吉翁萬歲)   2011-01-15 13:46:00
這標題講的好像已經頒完獎了
作者: alex710707 (PonWei)   2011-01-15 14:19:00
出賽場數的話當年Hamilton跟Mauer也只有133跟138場
作者: prereality (大鼠買一送一)   2011-01-15 15:21:00
感覺這次MVP可以決定以後到底是數據派還是傳統派取向
作者: Phater (肥特)   2011-01-15 15:24:00
Nate Silver這次總統大選估票出盡風頭,講話也大聲多了
作者: Uncontinue (骯康梯紐)   2011-01-15 17:30:00
又要開始戰了嗎...雖然我支持鱒魚 但感覺卡胖會得
作者: ss184 (雲淡風輕)   2011-01-15 21:13:00
那妳覺得三冠王好拿嗎?四十多年來只有一位 不給說不過去
作者: mightymouse (翻墮羅流大師)   2011-01-15 22:47:00
樓上才奇怪,過去多的是三冠王沒拿到MVP
作者: LuisB   2011-01-16 00:18:00
為什麼一直有人提三冠三冠 打棒球時好像還要防守跟跑壘耶
作者: LuisB   2011-01-16 00:19:00
更何況Trout也不是完全靠這兩樣 打擊方面根本差距不大
作者: LuisB   2011-01-16 00:20:00
如果看三冠很稀有就投MVP 那開放球迷票選就好了
作者: onime0704 (おにめ)   2011-01-16 08:54:00
多的是三冠王沒拿到MVP,要不要舉幾個例子出來?
作者: alex710707 (PonWei)   2011-01-16 09:09:00
1947 1942 Ted Williams 1934 Lou Gehrig1933 Chuck Klein 1922 Rogers Hornsby 有5次 但不算多
作者: lookers (實體店面 貨到付款 宅配)   2011-01-16 10:15:00
RISP??這個數據不是被當__嗎???
作者: vvvlove5566 (3V愛56)   2011-01-16 10:35:00
不是頂級成績還得三冠王 不代表她表現不好阿
作者: vvvlove5566 (3V愛56)   2011-01-16 10:37:00
因為今年所有打者都表現沒他好阿
作者: tonyselina (叫聲拔拔)   2011-01-16 11:59:00
打臉 XD 有人會說是傳統派勝利 lol
作者: chong527   2011-01-16 12:53:00
朝聖推
作者: Enolagay (飛來飛去)   2011-01-16 17:05:00
沒有MVP如何加冕45年來首次的三冠王?
作者: yiyin330 (L*VE westwroth miller)   2011-01-16 17:09:00
發文時是確定了嗎?? 今天馬上打臉
作者: ss184 (雲淡風輕)   2011-01-16 19:50:00
打臉了吧~~就說是米糕拿了

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